Who is the WAHM? This one is giving me a bad feeling… The WAHM needs to refund not only her fees, but the cost of the product.
Small Claims court would be worth it 100%. It only costs like $70 to file a case.
So we’re done for now. She refunded us the cost of embroidery. I’m not happy with the resolution because she has blamed the whole problem on us. We indeed asked for insurance…we have proof in e-mail. She also accused me of extortion because I asked for embroidery for free. All I asked for was her to embroider the rest of my stash (10 diapers) because she offered to replace 1/2 of the diapers and embroider them. I don’t know what else to say at this point. I’m glad she’s stopping her business so no one else can get burnt from a mistake as stupid as this. For the record, I think we have been very decent to this wahm since our box has been missing for almost 2 months. I know most “goodmama” mama’s would be VERY bent out of shape about this. We are considering legal action at this point.
From the WAHM: Well, I think I’ve lost hope that the package will show up. I’ve never had this happen before, so let’s try to figure out how much I owe you and Heather for this missing box.
I charged you 88.40 and Heather 54.65. There were 20 diapers in the box, but one of them (the emerald I embroidered with Deck the Halls for Heather) still belonged to me. A lot of the diapers, as I recalled were fairly well used and loved and were no longer silky, but I know that at least 4 of yours were NIP- China blue, macaw, 1 of the bikers, and giraffe. Were there any other NIP ones that I’m forgetting? I’m just trying to figure out the market value of the diapers that are missing.
I don’t know if it is expected that I reimburse you for the full price of the box that went missing. I looked up several cloth diapering businesses to see what their policies were on missing mail, and they said that if the package showed up as delivered on DC then the package was not replaceable and they wouldn’t refund. However, I do feel somewhat responsible for not adding the insurance. I do hope that you would remember that I’m not a huge business, and it’s hard when you’re a busy mom with three boys- mistakes can and do sometimes happen. Usually not to the diapers though, thank goodness ;o). Also, I’m not trying to shift blame at all, but mainly to let you know how I do things, usually if a customer wants insurance they add it when they purchase the slots on hc, which I am able to see right when I’m shipping, and since it was 20 something days between when Heather mentioned the insurance and I shipped, it would have been hard for me to remember, esp. since it was never paid for . At the time when I was shipping these diapers, I had several other large orders going through my house at the same time as people were preparing for Christmas and I was preparing to close down for December, and it’s hard to keep track of every little detail unless it’s mentioned on the note with the diapers or on the order/payment forms.
So, that’s where I am right now. Let’s try to figure out what would be a fair reimbursement, and I am more than happy to even do partial trades with my own stash, 2/3rds of which is still NIP.
From me: First of all I want to thank you for your willingness to help replace our diapers. I am sure you are as heartbroken as Heather and I are about this. I just wanted them to show up so we wouldn’t have to deal with this. I spent numerous months saving for and collecting the obvs I loved and wanted embroidered after seeing Heather’s beautiful diapers you did. Without going into details my husband and I are dealing with the housing crisis in Arizona and losing more than 1/2 the value on our home, moving to Alaska on our own dime, and living on one income. Heather’s husband has been deployed in Iraq for 6 months and she’s been taking care of her 5 kids with no help, also living on one income. We are all mom’s and understand how busy life can get with the kiddos. Basically we all have our own issues, kwim? You also mentioned the way we ordered, but as I recall this is how you wanted me to do it when I asked you. Next time I will be more than happy to through Hyena Cart.
As for what we expect….normally businesses say that they aren’t responsible for packages once they leave unless you purchase insurance. I just know that if insurance had been placed on the box that we wouldn’t be in this situation. It would have never been delivered as I would of have to pick them up at the post office. I know Heather wanted insurance because of how many diapers were in there and the value, plus coming to Alaska things tend to get lost sometimes.
I don’t how to value the diapers as most of them you can’t get through GM anymore since their sale and I have had an ISO out for them an no offers except for your Mudpie. Some of the color combos doesn’t matter to me, but I really really loved mudpie, overalls, beetle, drummer, slushie, and giraffe. I was able to snag a pure from her last stocking luckily because that was one of my favorites as well. Heather’s favorite was the orange with pink. Her’s were definently used, but still in vguc condition. Most of mine were NIP or used a couple times. We don’t mind the diapers being replaced with used diapers or diapers from your stash. I also have a few more obvs I wanted to get embroidered. We want to send you the the red obv as well since it was a trade for the emerald that you embroidered for Heather.
What do you think is fair based on the situation?
Thank you again for working with us on this situation.
From the WAHM: Why don’t I replace half the diapers missing. I will let Heather have 3 of these and Dana is welcome to have 7 of them. If they are used, we’ll count two as one. If the diapers you pick are not embroidered, I’d be more than happy to add embroidery for free.
Here’s what I have that I can offer you and Heather:
From me: Thank you for your response. I would be interested in Giraffe from your list. You also mentioned before that you had Mudpie, do you still have that? The rest of the diapers I either have or are too girly for us. I think I would rather have the paypal to try to replace my favorite’s from the missing box. I have already snagged a pure and a licorice. Also, could I send you the remainder of my obvs to have embroidered. I think there maybe be 10 total. I know at one point you said you might sell your London. Would you be interested in doing that now? Also, what would you like us to do with the red obv?
From the WAHM: We have a bit of a problem…
My husband came across the e-mail from Dana today. He gets my mail forwarded to his iPhone and reads it every now and then, which isn’t a big deal. He knew about the diapers getting lost and everything, but he didn’t know that I was going to try to reimburse you half for what was lost. He ended up giving me a long talk about this whole ordeal and how I should be running a business, not a charity. This is not the first time where I’ve tried to go above and beyond to make a customer happy and my husband thinks I’m going overboard this time. I am already running this business at a loss, and at the way I’m going, he’ll probably make me shut down if I continue to do things they way I have been. He told me that due to the fact that the purchase of insurance is available on my HC cart and it wasn’t purchased with the slots, and that most cloth diapering businesses will not tack it on after the fact because it seriously causes a nightmare to try to keep track of everything, as I now realize with this case. My own return policy, which was written back in February and which I never even thought to check until today states, “We are not responsible for items lost or damaged in transit…. Please note, we ship ALL PACKAGES with delivery confirmation or with a tracking number. If the package is scanned as “delivered”, the package is not replaceable. Please be sure to use a delivery address that has a secure location where the carrier can leave your package.” So, now here I am in a very awkward situation with a very stubborn husband and this whole situation on my hands. What it came down to was that my husband thinks that I offered way too much in way of making this up to you, however he said that I am free to do whatever I’d like with my own diapers, but I am not permitted to refund any money. Further, he feels that the total value amount that I should be reimbursing should be equal to the amount that you paid for the embroidery, however since I already promised more I will be sticking with what I originally said. So, there it is. I know this probably makes me wildly unpopular and probably will even make me deserving of some negative feedback somewhere, but I cannot go against my husband. You’re free to take any of the diapers that I offered (and I do have other embroidered diapers on my main website, along with other handmade items, if the diapers that I listed for you are not suitable), but I will not be able to go any further than that. I’m really sorry. I am already going way beyond what my husband thinks I should do and what others would have done in this situation, and I cannot do this for every single customer I have who has a problem. It just won’t work anymore.
The other thing that my husband brought up was what would happen if the diapers do show up eventually? If I’m sending brand new embroidered diapers and you use them, and then the originals show up, I end up being the only loser in the situation because the value of the diapers goes down as soon as they are worn the first time. I would appreciate if we could come up with a way to handle these diapers in case the others do eventually show up (and I’m still holding onto a glimmer of hope that they will…).
I hope this doesn’t come across as being mad or angry… I know it’s hard to judge the tone of an e-mail and we tend to make assumptions. I’m just really disappointed and frustrated, as I’m sure you both are, too. I would like to take care of this as quickly as possible, and before I send any replacements I would also like to have a plan for how we’ll handle these replacement diapers in the event that the original ever show up.
Our response: Wow that was alot to digest. I don’t even really know where to start. I guess, I should preface it by saying that Dana and I also ran a hyena cart account this Christmas, so I do understand the stresses of being a wahm. We did letters from Santa and had people sending us information EVERYWHERE. Before we could complete a letter we had to check info on PP, on HC and in our business email acct to make sure everything was completed correctly. So while I do understand mistakes happen, insurance WAS asked for and YOU said you would bill me for it. I cannot even fathom how you could print a label for that many goodmama’s and not insure it. You could have billed me again saying you forgot it in the original total. I TOTALLY would have paid it. Dana started a thread, a while back not outing you but stating what had happened and EVERY wahm that commented couldn’t believe that another wahm would ship a package with that value without insurance, REGARDLESS of payment or not.
I also once, we realized they were lost asked Dana to hold off on contacting you during the holidays, one to see if after the holiday rush they would show, and 2 to try and not stress you about it. I wanted you to have as good of a holiday as possible without worrying about diapers. I feel that we have been nothing but kind and Dana went above and beyond what ANYONE normally would in looking for this particular package. How many people do you know that would HANG FLYERS at -50 in search of diapers? I can’t even tell you the amount of times she has called, went to, or talked in person to either the mail carrier or someone at the post office. I would venture to guess in dealing with all this she has spent upwards of 20 hours, on hold, on foot, hunting for this box. She also shoveled anywhere this package could possible have ended up, all while dealing with some sort of allergic reaction COVERED IN HIVES, with a husband in Afghanistan. I also can’t tell you the number of times she told me she wished they would just show up. NEITHER of us wanted to have to deal with this amount of lost diapers. I’m sure you didn’t want to either.
You have also stated that it insurance should have been purchased with the HC slot. I’m sorry but that is beyond ridiculous. You told Dana to purchase one slot and then the 2 of you would figure out the details. I don’t think in anyway by purchasing that one slot with insurance would have changed anything. The plain and simple fact of the matter is you forgot to insure it. What your husband thinks is irrelevant. It is your business and your mistake. Running at a loss is neither mine nor Dana’s responsibility.
I also cannot believe that you would even think that is would be a problem if the diapers did indeed eventually show up. I am a very honest person. I would/ will pay you full value of the diapers with embroidery. I’m just that kind of person. I also aim to please people. I to have lost diapers in trasactions, that had PROOF that I indeed mailed them, and did the exact same thing as you(which by the way I believed to be completely fair) replaced half of the $. It wasn’t a small amount but it was the right thing to do. I know you know that in your heart to otherwise you wouldn’t have originally offered what you did. Which was much appreciated. The added drama not so much.
I’m just sick about this whole thing and Dana and I aren’t the type of people to just go and tell it on the Mountain how we feel we got screwed. Up to this point I felt everything was dealt with class, hence me not stepping in. I do not by any means feel that Dana asked for to much by asking for the $ for the diapers you can’t replace.
I just am so disappointed. You were on of my favorite wahms and you really were dealing with the situation with such class. It’s unfortunate that you would let your husband ruin that. You knew the right thing to do. I do understand husbands being husbands and I get that. But I also will stand up to mine if I believe I am right and doing the right thing even if it’s hard. You were doing the right thing. Why you would send such a negative email blows me away. Wouldn’t it have been easier just to say to Dana “No I’m sorry, I cannot offer a cash refund” Instead of making us feel at fault.
I don’t even know what else to say
In this issue I have tried to be more than generous with you- I probably came across poorly in my last e-mail, but in my defense I’m dealing with people pulling on my arms from either side and I had a lot of frustrations running through my mind as I wrote that e-mail. After going over the whole situation again with my husband and several very honest friends, I have come to the solid conclusion that I cannot in fact be held at fault for what occurred . In returning to the e-mail correspondence, I found this portion of an e-mail where I gave Heather the total that she owed.
Now, I looked up the price of mailing the diapers back. I use paypal, so I think it gives a slight discount. The rate is $9.30 for the FRB, so your total is $55.85. I hope to begin the diapers early next week )
When I gave her the total, I mentioned specifically that the s/h charges were for a FRB, without mentioning anything else. The original invoice I had sent before specifically mentioned that her charge would be $46.55 before shipping, so that number came from adding the FRB to the original total. If there had been a desire to add insurance, it was not mentioned before the payment was sent, nor was there any attempt to send payment for insurance after the agreement had been made. And, as I have stated before, I have always had a policy that I’m not responsible for packages where insurance has not been paid, and in this case it was not paid.
When I was in college I took two very challenging semesters of business law, and it happened to be one of my absolute favorite classes. One of the semesters we spent just on business contracts. Basically, in a contract you have an offer and an acceptance. After the acceptance of an offer (such as I will embroidery x diapers for you and you will pay x amount and I will ship with carrier X) has been made between two parties, a contract is formed. All new details after an acceptance is made must be agreed upon by both parties, as it forms a new contract. Not once in any of the e-mail correspondence did I agree to add insurance, and I cannot be legally found in breach of a contract for something that I never agreed to do.
The last three e-mails from both of you have been less than courteous. I didn’t respond to the first two right away just in order to let myself cool off before dealing with the situation again. When I was first made aware that the box was missing I felt regret at not adding insurance because I felt bad that your box got lost. I immediately blamed myself, however by detailing all the facts again I cannot consider myself at fault for what occurred. I am more than aware of all the trouble that has gone on in attempts to recover the diapers on your end, however no one forced you do it, and I will not be lead into feeling guilty for what you chose to do in hopes of finding the package. In addition, I do not appreciate being told that I will be doing further embroidery work for free. That’s nothing but extortion. And so I have discussed this problem at length with my husband and I have made up my mind on the issue. I am going to refund both of you the full amount that I charged for my embroidery fees. I will not expect this money to be returned in the case that the diapers show up. Furthermore, I will ask that if you have any future embroidery needs, that you go to Paully at Middle Earth, Nellybeans, or any one of many other WAHM’s that offer custom embroidery jobs. I will be closing down my business on February 10th and using the next 5 months to prepare for the arrival of my 4th child. Any extra embroidery work I take on from now on will be solely at my discretion.
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: North Pole AK
Diaper related, but not DS related My 19 lost GMs!!
So my friend and I sent off 19 Goodmama diapers to be embroidered back in November. We asked for insurance for the shipment back when we initially were doing the order since this was going to be $800++ in 1 flat rate box. Well the mama sent off the box at the end of November. We still had not recieved it as of last week so I e-mailed her and asked if she had the DC#. The DC# said the box was delivered on December 1st. I then asked for the insurance info. She forgot to insure it….. Now you might be saying that since it says it was delivered the insurance would not do anything for me, but at our PO if something has insurance they hold it at the PO and make you come in and sign for it. I have already contacted my PO and they said they can’t find anything, but will look after the holiday rush. My questions: Has anyone had anything like this with a positive outcome (being found)? Whose fault is it and what should we do???
|1-23-09, 02:31 AM
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: North Pole AK
Re: Diaper related, but not DS related My 19 lost GMs!!
Still hoping over here, but the wahm isn’t writing us back. I’m thinking it’s not looking good
12-22-2008, 10:08 PM